Marathon Recovery w/ Coach Jacob Phillips

In this month's Instagram Live Replay Coach Will Benitez and I discuss what the recovery looks like after racing a marathon! What happens after the marathon? Do you rest, do you keep running, do you run another race? This conversation goes into detail about what to do post-marathon! 

Connect with me (Coach Jacob) here:
https://www.rundoyen.com/running-coaches/jacob-phillips/

Connect with Coach Will here:
https://www.rundoyen.com/coaching-services/nutrition-coaching/

Join the Next Level Running Facebook Group: 
https://www.facebook.com/groups/nextlevelrunning

Follow @RunDoyen for IG Live sessions: 
https://www.instagram.com/rundoyen/

Follow Coach Will Benitez (On Pace Wellness) here: 
www.instagram.com/onpacewellness/

Check out RunDoyen if you are looking for a World Class Expert Run Coach to help you crush your running goals: https://www.rundoyen.com/

If you aren't quite ready for a Run Coach, check out the Doyen Dashers Program:
https://www.rundoyen.com/dashers/

Transcript

Jacob Phillips 0:17

This is the next level running podcast brought to you by the expert coaches at Run Goyo, helping runners of all levels trust their goals on race day by matching up with the perfect code for your play. Hello and welcome back to the next level running podcast. I'm your host, Jacob Phillips, and this is our monthly Instagram live replay. Tonight, uh Coach Will Benitez, he actually interviews me. We had a little bit of an issue at the end of our conversation. Um, but we're talking about marathon recovery, right? Like what happens after the marathon. Do you rest? Do you keep running? Do you do another race? We talk through what that looks like. So if you are at all interested in the marathon, if at if you're uh trying to figure out, well, what do I do after uh this marathon I've got coming up, or if you're trying to plan for the future, your future racing schedule, this is a great conversation for you. I think Coach Will does a great job at leading that conversation. And uh and I've got some experience with the marathon. Uh I I've I've done it well and I've done it wrong. And so uh you get to hear a little bit of my experience uh there and uh and just some of my thoughts on what we do post a marathon race. Like what's the recovery process look like? How long until we're jumping back into full training, that sort of stuff. I I do want to point you to the show notes before we get into the conversation. Um check out rundoyen.com. If you're looking for a running coach to help you crush your running goals, look no further than rundoyen.com. We have a roster full of expert uh run coaches uh who are willing to help. And so check out rundoyen.com if you're looking for a coach. If you're not quite ready for a coach or for a full-time coach, uh the next best thing is the Doyen Dashers program. So for only$39 a month, uh and I believe there's a free trial uh time in there as well, uh, you can get basically the next best thing. You get a well-written training program uh that you don't actually have the accountability of having to uh you know report back to a coach. I think it's the next best thing if you're not quite ready for that full-time running coach. Also, I'll have the um the contact info below for Coach Will. He is our in-house nutritionist here at Run Doyen and also uh my contact info if you've got questions for me, even if it's about the podcast, if you've got a topic that you want covered, hey, shoot me a message uh through the Run Doyen um website there. My contact info is there. But uh yeah, let's hop into this conversation. This is a uh great conversation between myself and coach Will Benita.

SPEAKER_00 2:54

I'll do a quick introduction to myself, pass it off to you, Jacob, to introduce yourself after, and then we'll uh we'll dig in. Yeah, yeah. All right. So hello again, everyone. My name is Will. I'm the uh in-house nutritionist uh with with Rondoyan. Um and I host these uh sessions here uh via Instagram uh ideally once a month. Uh so uh this is a space where we just kind of have a conversation with uh one of our uh Rondoyan coaches on you know a topic that is just uh of interest to them, but hopefully of interest to our runners as well. Um we try to cover, I mean, I mean we did this for oh gosh, I don't know, I think more than three years now. So we've covered a lot of topics in that amount of time. It's a lot of months. Um and I don't think we talked about the specifics of this one yet. So actually I'm like 99% sure we have it. So um let's pass it off to uh Jacob for a quick intro and then we'll we'll get into it.

Jacob Phillips 3:54

Yeah, yeah, I'm I'm Jacob Phillips. I've I've been coaching uh online with Run Doyen for almost two years now. I think it's two years of the summer. Uh I'm a head cross-country and track coach at Dallas Baptist University, and so we're an NCAA Division II uh cross-country program. And I've been the head coach there for 19 years, but been around the sport for you know at a at a relatively high level for for 20 plus years. And you know, I you know, we're gonna talk about about uh you know some some marathon stuff tonight, but but I love the marathon. I think it's I think it's uh it's not easy, but I think it's pretty simple uh to kind of nail down. And so yeah, I'm excited to talk a little bit about what to do coming out of that and and that sort of stuff. But yeah, based in Dallas, Texas, beautiful wife, two beautiful kids, living life, you know.

SPEAKER_00 4:37

That's amazing. That's great. Thanks, Jacob. Appreciate that. And yeah, I love it. I love it, you know, uh, like you said, marathon, not easy, but you do have some relatively simple um uh tips, you know, ways to guide people, if you will. Of course, yeah, when when people kind of come on with you, that that that's a whole process, right? That's a that's the whole coaching relationship. But we're gonna talk about today um some specific tips, not necessarily just around marathon training and recovery. Um we are gonna really hone in on that recovery piece. But um what should be fun is when you got that marathon and you run it and like how quickly can you come back, right? How quickly, whether that's just for training or for another race. And that could be another marathon, that could be uh 5K when to do that, how to do that, um, when not to do that. Uh I've I've always been really curious about that. That's not a conversation I've ever had with a coach. I will say I run a marathon and then I ended up doing a 5k the next day. It was a Saturday marathon, and I did a 5K the next day. Um survived, uh ran a decent time. Uh luckily didn't injure myself. Um, I think I was young enough where I could do that. I don't think I could this must have been like six, seven years ago. I don't think I could do that now. Um but again, that could fall into a uh what not to do, maybe the tight timeline um or tight a tight turnaround. But let's talk about that, right? Because people can easily fail at this. And I do think even though I survived that, it's probably uh not the best way to go. So I can learn here too. Yeah. So um, you know, let's talk about maybe first like just what practical recovery from the marathon looks like. Um, what are your tips on that? You just cross that finish line. Maybe recovery starts even before that marathon, right? But let's start where you think is best to start.

Jacob Phillips 6:43

Yeah, you know, and I and I think um so what I want to do is kind of like lay out like what that would look from a physical standpoint, right? Like running a 5k the next day, yeah, maybe not the the the best thing to do. Sometimes it works, right? And then I think you could probably give some great tips from a nutrition standpoint, like what they probably need to do that day, and then what that kind of looks like. Um, you know, I I think I think I think you're the the expert on that. But you know, for me, I I I think that in most cases, uh you should probably take uh seven to ten days of rest and then seven to ten days of this uh kind of this gradual build back in into running, not into training, but just getting the body moving. And I don't think that seven to ten days of rest means you go sit on the couch and you don't move. I think movement is is part of recovery, right? And uh just like the nutrition is part of recovery, uh, but I think you don't train for seven to ten days. And I think you go out for a walk or you go for a spin on the bike, or you know, depending on the weather, you hop in the pool, like you do some movement. I think movement is really good to flush out the soreness, to, to, to make sure, one, make sure you didn't injure yourself. You know, I've I've had some marathons where I've I've gotten uh like hurt on the marathon, but I didn't realize it until a few days later. And so, like, but going out for a walk and saying, wow, this hurts really bad. Okay, let me go out and walk tomorrow, it's still hurting. But so I think that that movement is important post-race, uh, but not necessarily in a run or a jog, but more so, hey, I'm gonna go for a light walk. Hey, I'm gonna I'm gonna go for a bike ride. Again, not like a two-hour, I'm gonna hammer the the hills on a bike ride, but I think movement is really good to help speed up that recovery process. I'd be curious though, uh, because I do think there's some things pre-race that you should do as well, but I'd be curious, like when you finish the marathon race, like what would you suggest as a nutritionist that you should do probably within the next day, even you know, you've crossed the line, what's the next 24 hours like nutritionally?

SPEAKER_00 8:46

Yeah, so um, you know, you're really gonna want to re-um like replenish those electrolytes. That's usually the number one thing I tell people is uh whether it's a like a you know cold, kind of like late fall race or you know, summer marathon, number one thing to do is replenish your electrolytes. So for me, before that celebratory beer, uh, you know, some people may partake it. Um get that water back in, even if you had a really good, you know, um hydration strategy throughout and you were kind of replenishing liquids as you went along, uh, you're still gonna be in a deficit. So get that liquid in, get those electrolytes in. Usually pack that stuff with you. Um don't rely on the you know finishing or finishers like you know, uh food station or what have you. Um uh so outside of water and electrolytes, which I do think you should just kind of hammer, get one, two, maybe three servings in there throughout the rest of that day. Um kind of almost take like a uh um another like a carb loading approach, right? Like get those carbs back in. Um you even from a caloric standpoint, even if you were fueling every 45 minutes, like you really dialed that in, whatever that looked like, you're still gonna be in a deficit. So especially if you're trying to maximize recovery, let's say you're trying to do kind of get back into training as quickly as possible, or you are kind of you know looking to do another event in you know two weeks or three weeks or a month, um, carb load for that next day, you know? Yeah, your body's gonna thank you for it. Obviously, yeah, good eat healthy carbs, you know. Don't uh I don't mean just eat cookies all day long and get your carbs that way. You know, celebrate, maybe have a cookie, that's fine. Um, but then you know, get the potatoes and get the sweet potatoes, some brown rice, some you know, plenty of fruit, like just get those carbs back in. You do want your diet to be probably like 60, 65% carbohydrate for that day. For sure. Um, with with um probably like 15% at least, um, since carbs are gonna be so high of protein. Um normally it'd be like a 20, 20, maybe 5% protein intake, but we are kind of really emphasizing for at least 24 hours um carbohydrates a lot for that recovery. Um and then yeah, you're just gonna emphasize protein the rest of the way. Let fat just kind of sneak in there where it can. But really, the focus is gonna be on carbs and protein.

SPEAKER_01 11:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:01

Um, and so all your meals, you know, have what I tell people is okay, you're not done recovery, which is why I led with that question before. Like you, you're you may start your recovery process before the marathon begins. Because what I do think is really helpful to do is to have a plan for what you're gonna do post-marathon from a nutritional perspective. Like actually bring that food with you or know what restaurant you're gonna go to, what you're gonna eat. Like, try to have some sort of a plan um for how you're gonna maximize that like next like one to two hours post-marathon from a nutritional perspective. So if you want to plan out the rest of your day and know what carbs you're gonna get in and what protein sources, hey, that's great. It's only gonna help you. You don't have to get super, you know, uh hyper focused on that. But yeah, it's really getting those electrolytes in, welcoming those carbs, and then really trying to fit protein in that every meal or snack time that you're gonna have that day.

Jacob Phillips 11:58

Yeah, I think it's 100%, and I think you hit on with the um like the the the pre-race, but also so I I was really um I was really bad at taking the nutrition during the race. And I know like when I have clients that nailed the nutrition during the race, and then obviously, you know, it's a hyper focus after the race because it's it's a little easier after the race, right? Like during the race, it's some people don't handle uh they don't they don't like the the the the gels or they don't the their stomach doesn't handle as well. But when you do that well during the race, that kick starts the recovery process, right? And and and I think if you can do that well during the race, if you're taking something every 35 to 45 minutes, you're gonna come, you're gonna recover out of that quicker, I think. I I would just be I would be so depleted um after my marathons. I I remember my marathon PR I ran in grandma's and it was a perfect weather day. It was 42 degrees, perfect weather day, but I struggled taking in enough electrolytes, enough calories. And I remember my wife had to and I ran 230, 43, so pretty good time, right? And my wife had to had to basically carry me out of the finishing chute. We went to get warm and take a shower, get warm. I couldn't even lift my leg up to get the sweats off because I'd start cramping, you know, like and so and then, and we're gonna talk about this in a little bit, and then trying to come back and run a week later, my quads were just so heavily fatigued. I mean, something I'd never felt before, you know, like um like literally dead legged, you know, and and so I think like do, you know, obviously there's some nutritional stuff you gotta do in the days, weeks leading into the race, but you've got to make sure you take care of that. And like, and like I I had sweet potatoes, I had a good burger, like like I ate a lot after the race, but I was in such a hole, I was so depleted, it it was it was I had too much to make up, right? And so so so I I'm with you on you know what you do you know during the race, uh what you do before the race, that's gonna help that recovery process as well, with especially nutritionally, you know. Um but but you know, jumping back to that practical kind of recovery out of a marathon, um, you know, I talked about I ran that that PR at grandma's perfect the other day, so it wasn't like it was a hot summer marathon. Um and I I tried to jump back in too quick. I try to jump, I was like, I'm gonna take a week and then I'm gonna get back into it. I'm gonna try for a run. And and that was the most miserable run I might have ever gone on. And and so what I try to encourage now is is let's I'll give you that seven to ten days of rest, but it's not just laying on the couch, it's not just like go go move, be active with that. Make sure you're make excuse me, make sure you what's your dog's name? There you go. No, you're good, you're good. But what I was gonna say is is like like take that seven to ten days of of recovery, and and you're not training, you're not trying to jump back into it too quickly, but you're focused on that nutritional game plan. You're getting out, you're moving, you're walking, and you're letting the body recover because the body has to recover. And and and when you come out of that seven to ten days of of rest where you have been moving, you have been you have been active without training, you've been focusing on that nutritional plan coming out of it, then we're real light to build back into it. It's like a transition back into training. And typically that can be something as light as a 15 to 20 minute jog every other day uh for seven to ten days. But you want to be very like I would I would really caution, like unless it's a really quick turnaround because you've got to do something else, right? And and and I've had that too, and I've had I've had some athletes have some big success with that. But but if you did not take care of yourself and if you fully depleted yourself in that race, right, then you've really got to be careful with that what with what that recovery looks like before you jump back into, hey, let's train, you know.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

Yeah, that's a good point you mentioned. So yeah, it probably does like if that marathon was like your your goal race, right? And you really left it all out there, like that was the key. I mean, at that point, it's like, well, what's the what's the race you know three weeks later about then?

SPEAKER_01 16:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:21

Um let's say you didn't, right? I I imagine that if you left it all out there and that was your that was your goal race, or or it just, you know, uh you had both on the calendar, but you just so happened to just really go all in on that marathon. Or other side of that, it was for fun. Let's say maybe you just challenge yourself, maybe you did it with a friend, maybe it was a destination thing, you're on vacation. Um I I imagine that how you approach and how you executed that marathon is going to affect what you're able to do, how quickly you're able to turn around uh for you know an event, whatever it is, two, three, four weeks later. Um obviously you're gonna want to kind of emphasize recovery and and do all those little steps no matter what. You did just run 26.2 miles. Whether it took you five hours, which hey, that's a lot of running, yeah, or three hours, you did run that distance um and that's a lot on the body.

unknown 17:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:20

How much you really left out there and how much you're really left with after the after that marathon comes into play. And maybe that's something you kind of um this is maybe semi-question, is like maybe that's a conversation you might have with an individual in that moment. Like, let's talk about how you're feeling. Let's talk about how that race went. Is that something you try to do?

Jacob Phillips 17:40

Yeah, and so I like I and and and we've had uh I've had clients or or athletes that I've coached in the past that hey, we're gonna run this marathon uh as a trial run. We're not going 100%, like we're we're not gonna be fully peaked for it, like it's more of a workout. Um, and then the and the real test is in a month or five weeks or six weeks, right? Uh and yeah, you would approach that differently than now if we come out of it and we're feeling like I was feeling after after grandma's in in 2013, then we we probably did something wrong, right? But but like like there's no better practice than actually doing it. But again, that's a lot to ask the body. You know, so when I PR'd at grandma's, um, I actually it it wasn't a month turnaround, but but I actually had run uh like a late March marathon that was my goal. And uh and coach Coach Mark Hadley, a run doing coach, was my coach at the time, and and I didn't hit my goal. And and I finished that race, uh I I was I was perfect to about 19 miles, but I could not figure out the fueling. I I wasn't taking liquids, it wasn't something I practiced well. Anyways, and I came out at the marathon and I said, and I and I jogged it in, right? So I didn't deplete myself. It was I hit the wall at 19 and I just survived. And I said, I called up Coach Mark and I said, Hey, look, like if I can figure out the fueling, I know I can handle the pace. I don't want to wait. I'm ready to do this. And so we were looking for, well, one, we want a good marathon, a good weather marathon, we want a fast course, and then like we don't want it to be so far off. And so we had probably about eight to ten weeks to really try to dial in the nutrition plan, right? And and and to be honest, I I I didn't do that very well, and and that's that's why I was so depleted after grandma's, but like that's two really good marathons because I I PR'd at the one that I I hit the wall in, but but it was like I know I can go the pace I want to run. Um, and I still hit the wall at grandma's at like 24, but like that was nutritionally. I I had an athlete, Kelsey Bruce, that I coached. She made the 2019 World Championships and represented Team USA at in Doha Qatar, and and uh and and we could talk about the recovery from that thing because that was 110 degrees at the start. And but but the reason she qualified was because we had you know, she got invited to New York City Marathon. It was uh uh we had put all of our eggs in this New York City Marathon basket, but being in Texas, we're from Texas, we we always do something at Houston, Houston Marathon, Houston half. We always have that on the calendar, and that's about 10 weeks, 12 weeks after. And uh and and New York City did not go well. Uh we were training in the summer in Texas, it was hot, it was humid, uh, it just did not go well. And and we didn't want to lose this this big bank of fitness that we had built up. And so um, and so we had a really quick turnaround to get ready for Houston. And so I think she ran uh her PR at the time was maybe 234. I think she ran 242 at New York, and then we came to Houston and we ran 231 with a short turnaround. But but New York was one of those things where after about halfway, it wasn't our day, and and not that we gave up, but we didn't deplete ourselves, it just wasn't our day, right? I I think when you deplete yourself fully, and and she depleted herself at Houston, and we had a big break after Houston, and we were able to uh to kind of revamp and say, well, what do we want to do? And so I think it's like I think it's having that conversation with that athlete, and I think it's like in the situations where I got my marathon PR and Kelsey got her marathon PR, uh, it was that wasn't the day we wanted, and we knew what we could fix, and we had this quick turnaround. I I think normally you don't do that. I think I think normally you you you take your break, you take your seven to ten days, you take your transition back into running, and then you say, okay, well, what's next at that point, right? And and I think I think it's pretty traditional, you know. You you you you don't want to in most cases, you don't want to run more than two marathons a year, right? And there's gonna be some situations where you make you might run three, but maybe the next year you run one. Um but I think you come out of that marathon and you change the focus, right? And you and you kind of you kind of like let that kind of die down and and allow the body to do something different before you build back up again, you know. And I think you had kind of mentioned that with like the 5K and such, you know.

SPEAKER_00 21:52

Yeah, yeah. I'm glad you actually circled back to that piece um on uh like the seven to ten days. Really going light, you know, emphasizing movement, but not necessarily training. Now, after 10 days, let's say that there is an event coming up, right? Whether it's a 10k half or another another marathon, if that's if that's you know possible for some people. Um what do you do after 10 days, right? Day 11's here. How do you navigate and let's say let's say there's two weeks in between day 11 and the next event? Um how are you navigating that? Um well, I was thinking maybe it's a little bit longer because if it's only two weeks and it's a marathon, you know, it's a week of like pick picking up a little bit of training, and then obviously race week you're gonna calm it down again, I think.

Jacob Phillips 22:43

Well, no, so so I I don't I think it was in 2011.

SPEAKER_01 22:46

Uh-huh.

Jacob Phillips 22:46

I think I think it was Moses Mosop. He I think he won the Boston Marathon. And then about 30 days later, I think he set the world record for the 30k on the track at the at the pre-classic in in Eugene. And and and Renato Canova was, I believe, was coaching of the time and was interviewed. And and Canova said, you know, and you know, uh a lot of Americans, you know, I think that's most of our audience, a lot of Americans think that you you run this marathon and you've lost all the work you put in, right? But the truth is, is there is a huge adaptation, it's a huge stimulus when you when you when you run this marathon. There's nothing more specific that you've done, right? And so I think if you do have that quick of a turnaround, as long as you're healthy coming out of that that rest, um, I don't think you lose a ton. You know, I I just don't I I I think the fitness is is maybe as long as you're healthy, the fitness might be as good as it's ever been, right? Um again, as long as you're healthy. Um because I I think when we're you know, when we're when we're chasing something in training, the the most specific that you can get uh is gonna give you the best adaptation for that for that event, right? And so it if if you now obviously you don't you can't go every 10 days or every two weeks running another marathon and and look for one optimal performance, but but also probably long-term health, right? Um but I think you can have that quick turnaround. I I've got a I've got a client that that ran a marathon this weekend and ran a ran a it wasn't a P it wasn't a PR, it was his first one. But when you look at his half marathon to his marathon, like this was a huge performance, right? And uh and so we're we're in our seven to 10 day rest resting phase and then we'll we'll build back up. But but he emailed me today and said, hey, May 29th, I want to do this 5K Memorial Day 5K. And I'm like, yeah, we've got plenty of time to do that, and I think we can do that well. You know, I think we'll have time to to recover, to build back, and then to even have a little mini kind of 5K training block. I think you have plenty of time to do that. Um I think that's beneficial because I think the the you know the the faster the faster that you get over the shorter distances, the easier I think the pace becomes for the for the marathon, right? I think it's kind of all math, right? Like a faster 5k leads to a faster 10k and and up the up the line. But um, but yeah, I I think I think we can kind of say you're healthy, you feel good coming out of it, we're better than we've ever been. Like this is as this is as fit as we are. I don't think you lose that fitness, is what I'm trying to say, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 25:20

Makes perfect sense. It really does. And I love the I love like the the example of this client who just did a marathon and applying what you were just talking about to this situation, which I think resonates probably with a lot of people. I know a lot of people who probably, you know, here in Portland, for example, we've got you know, obviously all the fall marathons around, and then we have, for example, like an early December um 5k, 10k half marathon option. Yeah. Uh it's called the holiday half. That's really popular here in Portland, right? It's kind of like the Shamrock run. It kind of closes out the season. Yeah. Sharonrock usually opens it, opens up the year. Um, so I imagine, you know, some people may run their fall, you know, marathon and then look at like, oh, I'm signing up for that holiday half early December. But you know, that's probably like similar to this guy who did just did the marathon and then wants to run this 5k. Um and I I also imagine that um, like it's very possible, like you just said, that uh resonates a lot, but that it's also very possible to get wrong. Yes. Where they're like, okay, I'm gonna do my seven to ten days, go really easy. That's easy to get wrong. But let's say it went out really well. And then back to my original questions like day 11's here, you know. Do I am I back to workouts? Like, am I back to 50 mile weeks? Like, what does that look like as I get as I get ready for that 5k? Um, I'm I'm used to you know 60 plus mile weeks with my marathon. How do I how do I transition to 5k, 10k, you know, mini block or something like that? I imagine it's really easy to kind of get lost in like what to do there to not like overtrain or to not injure yourself.

Jacob Phillips 26:57

Yeah, and and and I honestly think with online clients, they're they're they're paying for a product, like they're ready to get back to work usually, right? Like they're really motivated. And I think trying to really preach that patience of like like we're not going to jump right back in uh at the highest of levels, right? Like we might be, we might be 30, 40, or 50 percent of what that peak mileage might have been. It might even be less than that, you know. Like I have I have some clients that will run you know 70 to 80 or 80 plus miles a week up to 100 miles a week. We're probably gonna do on day 11, hey, a 20-minute shakeout run. Like, I want you to jog, like like jog this and see how you feel, right? And then and I think that's where the coaching comes in, right? Having that coach where you have that relationship, you say, Hey, I actually felt really good. Or I felt terrible. Okay, cool, we're gonna rest tomorrow, and then maybe we'll come back on day 13 with a run, right? Like, and so I think that's super important. But I think like the when we talk about going into this block of training, I think like it's gonna be really different, right? It's probably not going to be long, sustained tempo runs. It's probably not gonna be really long, long runs where we're really focused on, well, what does the hydration and nutrition look like on these runs? It's probably gonna be uh like uh you know, more speed-based or more um speed play-based kind of thing, where maybe we're running 30 second to one minute fast intervals, which we might not do a ton of that in the last month or six weeks leading into a marathon. So it might be the opposite end of the spectrum, which honestly might be a welcome break to to just the way your legs feel and just how you're feeling internally with all that and such. And so um that's I think that's where we would probably take it. You know, I think I think good training is is is it it transitions across the spectrum, right? Like uh, you know, you did an awesome Instagram live, I think it was with Coach TJ back in the fall about uh threshold training or tempo training, you know, whatever the term is that that the person wants to use for it. And like, man, we use that for track events and we use that for the half marathon, and we use that for the marathon, and we use it for the 5K. And so there will still be some of that, but it will be more specific to that shorter race or that whatever that alternative race.

SPEAKER_00 29:22

Uh unless it's me. I don't know. Uh Coach Jacob. Sorry about that folks. Yeah, I don't know if it's me or if it's Coach Jacob here, but hopefully we get we get him back. We are gonna be wrapping up here in a moment. Might wrap up too than I thought and not the way I wanted. Yeah, okay, we lost Coach Jacob. Well, hey, um, we were wrapping up at the at the half hour mark anyway. So um well, I want to just thank you all for joining. I I hope you go back and watch the previous um podcast that we or not podcast, uh Instagram live that we did with Coach Jacob again, probably a year or so ago. Um you can just kind of um uh I guess you got to scroll a little bit of a ways uh in our feed to find that. But it's a that was a good one. Hopefully this was a good one too. I like I said before to to Jacob, like I've been in that position where um ran a marathon and I wanted to kind of turn around, or if I'm talking with people or even just planning out my year, like figuring out, oh, I want to do this race, but there's this other race I've been wanting to do where I'm gonna be in such and such location and I want to run there too. How do I navigate that? And I do think as I was kind of wrapping up here with Coach Jacob about um having a coach, you know, can be really, really helpful. If that's if that's what you want to do or tend to do, like kind of really, you know, pack a lot in like your your quarters, if you will, and put a lot on your plate, um, navigating as healthily as you can, especially long-term wise. Um a coach can be really, really helpful in like having you um do that in a healthy way, uh holding you accountable to not overdoing it, which runners maybe are more prone to do. Um yeah, just just uh just I don't know, a really great reason to kind of bring um bring a coach into the mix here. Um, uh Coach Jacob is still here, just can't go on video. Yeah, my phone got too hot. No worries, Coach. Listen, if you um want to get back into uh sorry, if you want to get in contact with Coach Jacob, um you can head to rondoyan.com. You can uh go to your browse coaches, um, and then you can find Coach Jacob that way. And what you can do is great, you can uh message Coach Jacob with uh questions you may have, you kind of chat with him that way, see if it's a good fit, or you can also um schedule a free consult with Coach Jacob. So hopefully you get in touch. Uh he's a phenomenal guy, great coach, clearly knows his stuff. I think he'd be an awesome one to uh at least reach out to, see if you um uh see if you just kind of bye with him. And uh hopefully that that is a productive uh conversation. So thank you all for being here. Um thank you for uh taking some time out of your day and for uh being part of this episode with uh with Coach Jacob. Uh hope you all take care. I'll put this on the feed.

Jacob Phillips 32:21

And that does it for this month's Instagram live replay edition of the Next Level Running Podcast. Uh thanks so much for joining along. Sorry for the issue at the end. My phone got uh got really hot and so uh it froze up. And so we weren't able to finish the conversation, but I think you got the details. I think you got what you needed out of that. If you've got any questions that might not have been answered from that conversation, uh don't hesitate to reach out to either uh myself or Coach Will. Uh our contact info is listed in the show notes below. Also, I didn't mention this before the the the podcast, but um if you're not following along uh on Instagram with Run Doyen, hit that follow button. Uh that's where you'll be notified every time we go live for one of these Instagram live events where we uh interview uh Coach Will interviews some of our expert run coaches or expert nutrition coaches, right? And so check that out, give a follow. Um also if you're not part of the uh next level running uh Facebook community group, uh give that a join as well. It's a great uh place to just pick up on uh or be part of a community that uh that loves running, wants to uh dive into conversations and tips and advice and encouragement, all that kind of good stuff involving running. But uh hey, thanks so much again for joining us uh this month uh with the Instagram live replay. We'll be back on the 13th of May and then again on the 26th of May, where we'll have a full form and then our Instagram live. And so uh we appreciate you joining us. And until next time, have a great run. Thank you for joining us here on the Next Level Running Podcast, your source for training advice from the expert coaches at Rundoyan. If you're ready to take your training and rate to the next level, head over to Rundoyan.com and get matched up to your ideal coach, who will provide you with the highly customized online training you need for crushing your goals on race development.